3 Betfair Questions

[wb]

1. Is there a 'Results' section in betfair, where you can check the 'betfair SP's' (for want of a better word) on a race you did not gamble on yourself.
i.e. the prices of back and lay just before the off? im working on a system, and paper trading, so im not using my own records and when looking back at races, I have to go by the official sp's - but i want to know betfair's prices at the off.

2. Similarly, If you have not backed on a race yourself, is there a way of looking at the betfair price flucuation charts for particular horses? Currently, when I click on an old race, it says 'This event is no longer available........' Again, I am paper trading, so dont have my own bet records to go by.

3. I have 2 credit cards. Can I open up a new betfair account with the same credit card that I opened the first account with, or do i have to use my second credit card? (it is becoming hard to try to keep the systems and banks seperate in my head - or on paper for that matter, so I want to have 2 seperate betfair accounts)

Thanks, Wayne

[mathare]

The answer to 1 and 2 is no. At least none that I am aware of. For paper trading purposes, if it is a backing system calculate to SP and for laying systems work to SP+20%. They should give you worst case scenarios and when using real Betfair data you should be able to beat either set of prices and thus make bigger profits than your records would suggest.

Not sure on the answer to 3 but I think you do need to use a different card, yes. Not 100% sure on that though.

[presto]

3. I have 2 credit cards. Can I open up a new betfair account with the same credit card that I opened the first account with, or do i have to use my second credit card? (it is becoming hard to try to keep the systems and banks seperate in my head - or on paper for that matter, so I want to have 2 seperate betfair accounts)

NO - you will have to use your 2nd credit card. - also try not to use credit card's, - use a 'solo' etc... as betfair charge 1.5% of your deposit.

[presto]

2. Similarly, If you have not backed on a race yourself, is there a way of looking at the betfair price flucuation charts for particular horses? Currently, when I click on an old race, it says 'This event is no longer available........' Again, I am paper trading, so dont have my own bet records to go by.

you don't need to back in the race to look at the chart's - just click the horse name. - it takes about 5 mins for betfair to settle the market, then it says 'This event is no longer available' - if you are quick you can catch it. - but the graph are pretty usless then, as when the price goes to 1000 - the graph dosn't show many fluctuations due to the scale.


1. Is there a 'Results' section in betfair, where you can check the 'betfair SP's' (for want of a better word) on a race you did not gamble on yourself.

NO - you have to check manually, - there is a program out there that records the live prices into XL, but this is very advanced also £50 - so i wouldn't say it is particulary worth it. some API programmer will probably come up with a basic one soon.

[wb]

for laying systems work to SP+20%. .

So, for an example mathare, to make sure i have this right:

My system has a cut- off, where i dont lay at more than 10.5

I put a race through my spreadsheet, and it comes up with a horse that I should lay, (lets say in the evening time, after all races are over and I dont know the result). I then go get the results @ official sp's.

Lets say the official sp for horse 1 was 8/1 (9.0) - add on 20% and that gives me a price of 10.6 - therefore this horse does not qualify to be layed as my cut off is 10.5

is this how it works? where did you get the 20% figure?

Thanks

[Roberto]

3. I have 2 credit cards. Can I open up a new betfair account with the same credit card that I opened the first account with, or do i have to use my second credit card?
As has already been said, yes: you do have to use a different credit-card initially to fund a new account. But you can do that with £10 or whatever the minimum payment-in is, if you choose to, and then send a cheque for whatever you want to fund the additional account, even if you've previously funded your original account from the same bank account.

[mathare]

Lets say the official sp for horse 1 was 8/1 (9.0) - add on 20% and that gives me a price of 10.6 - therefore this horse does not qualify to be layed as my cut off is 10.5

is this how it works? where did you get the 20% figure?If SP was 8/1 (9.0) then SP+20% would be 10.8 (9.0+(0.2*9.0)) so outside your cut-off, yes. If were to cut-off at 10.5 as you say then you may choose to include 8/1 SP or exclude them, it's up to you in the long run. But whatever you choose be consistent.

The 20% figure is Betfair's advertised margin over SP. They advertise that their customers, on average, get 20% better than SP. The actual figures are more skewed towards bigger percentages on bigger prices (SPs of 16/1 normally go off around 20+ on the exchanges whereas odds-on runners are more or less in line with the exchange prices) but it makes a good average to work to. If you use SP+20% and show a profit when laying then you should make a better profit using real Betfair data. If you can't profit at SP+20% you may make a tiny profit with real Betfair data but you'd probably be pushing it.

[wb]

If SP was 8/1 (9.0) then SP+20% would be 10.8 (9.0+(0.2*9.0)) so outside your cut-off, yes. .

Ok, i see, I got a different figure because I was working out the 20% from the 8/1 figure, i.e. 20% of 8 is 1.60. 8 + 1.60 = 9.60 (or 10.6 on betfair) because the 9.0 includes the stake.

It would probrally be just as easy, when trying my system on old races to have a cut off using the fractional prices, lets say 8/1 or something instead of trying to add the 20% thing on all of them

[bigcumba]

Wayne, if you need to get an idea of the prices a horse went off at you can use Oddschecker - but they don't keep details of place markets, just win only - and only till the end of the day

[koykos]

i would like to ask you about betafair charts..can they "show' you the trend of the market?....at horse racing.....

thanks sorry for my english...

[roma]

Yes Koykos if you click on the horse's name you get the chart which shows whether the price has been going up or down.

If there is a non-runner they seem to adjust the whole chart from the beginning to take account of the new lower prices. So the whole chart just moves up or down the scale.

Of course even if a horse's price has been going steadily up or down, that does not always mean it will continue in that direction. It only needs something like a rumour going round the racecourse that the horse is looking good or not, or a rumour about another horse, and the direction of the chart can suddenly change. Or sometimes I think people see the chart going up and they jump in to lay quickly, pushing the price up higher than it would naturally go, and then it will of course come down again. And vice versa for a chart that is going down. But they are quite useful all the same.

[Win2Win]

You can get software for £50 that registers all the data on your PC, then you can play with any way you want in a spreadsheet.... www.exchangebots.com

[John]

Hi Wayne

Are you recording your bets on paper or in a spreadsheet? If you're using a spreadsheet it's difficult to get muddled up between them as you simply have each system on a separate sheet (or workbook). An additional reason not to open a new account is that the new account will have the highest commission level (think it's about 5%). Keeping all your betting activity in just one account will result in your commission rate falling faster.

[wb]

Hi John. Thanks for the help, but I posted this in October :)

Sorted it out since.

Thanks anyway

[Win2Win]

He's putting together a book; "1001 Wbailey Questions" :D

[John]

Oh yeah! So you did! Oh well, I hope it comes in useful to someone, sometime, someday. :)