SP's question

[wb]

How exactly is the SP decided.

I know that it is down to what prices are available on track (which seem to be getting closer to betfair all the time).

Lets say there were 8 bookies on track, and four of them offered horse A at 10/1 and four of them offered 12/1. Does this mean that the SP would be around 11/1??
Is there an independent body that monitors the prices and then gives and 'average' official sp? or how exactly does it work.

thanks.

Wayne

[bigcumba]

I think it's whatever the bookies think they can get away with!

[mathare]

I was reading about this the other day, let me go and get me book....

The principles for returning an SP are:

1) SP is generally the price available at the off to good money
2) The sample of on-course bookies (usally 12) will only include those willing to lay a decent sized bet in the context of the given market
3) All bookies in the sample have equal weighting. Rails bookies should be included but not more than 2 of the major off-course outfits shall be included
4) If more than 2/3 of the sample agree that's the SP, otherwise "generally available" is defined as being offered by 1/3 of the sampled bookies
5) Close calls are settled in favour of the punter

[wb]

thanks mathare, that makes sense.

just one thing, who samples the books for the prices? Is there some sort of independent crowd at each track doing this?

[mathare]

They used to have 2 blokes per course working on behalf of the SP Executive (Trinity Mirror Group and Press Association I think, with SIS acting as observer) collecting prices but now I think it is done by computer.

[markwales]

I know that it is down to what prices are available on track (which seem to be getting closer to betfair all the time).



All the on course bookies have a laptop running Betfair now. I was at lowly Towcester the other week, and EVERY bookie was trading on Betfair as well as on course. This surely is one of the reasons the prices are a lot closer.

Was quite funny trying to get a glimpse of their Betfair balances :D

[mathare]

All the on course bookies have a laptop running Betfair now. I was at lowly Towcester the other week, and EVERY bookie was trading on Betfair as well as on course. This surely is one of the reasons the prices are a lot closer.It was the same at Sandown when I was there in the summer. I couldn't believe when I first saw it but it makes sense

Makes you wonder how many bookies have actually become traders at the big meetings though

[presto]

i remember a while ago the big 3 were going mad about the new way SP was calculated.

they were saying that because the on-course bookies were laying off on betfair, they could take larger bet's at larger prices. so they could advertise larger odd's. - this meant the SP was larger as the on course bookies could run to a smaller overound.

and as the prices of the on course bookies were larger the SP were calculated larger. as you could imagine the big 3 didn't like this one bit as there profit was being cut.

so they wanted to introduce 'industry prices' - or SP to a high overound book chosen by the big 3 not a selection of on course bookies. - i still hear a bit of noise on 'industry prices' every now and again, but nothing has happened so far.

[Win2Win]

That's why the 2-4-6 struggled due to the squeeze by the bookies laying off.

[Profit Seeker]

When you say "laying off" does this mean they take advantage of being able to lay at SP and then back at a bigger price on betfair? So really laying off is actually backing off? :doh

[Win2Win]

Yes & no. Bookmakers are layers, so they layoff some of the risk.

[icebreaker]

Last week, both Will Hills and Fred Done (among other high street bookmakers) have made a corporate decision to lay-off their risks on the exchanges rather than in the on-course market. The day of "industry prices" gets nearer.

[Profit Seeker]

With prices shortening, it can only help us layers.

[Win2Win]

Industry prices wouldn't bother me :) I always shop around for the best available, and they'd only lose business on the Interent to a higher % take, although this means Joe Punter in the bookies getting screwed.