Kaka

[John]

:splapme

Manchester City reportedly are in talks with AC Milan over buying Kaka for a world record fee of £100m.

Weekly wage... £500k.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/m/man_city/7827696.stm

:censored: ridiculous, this sport. It's going out the window.

[mathare]

The Sun reports he'd be on a more reasonable £280k a week

[jonahjones]

At 19.59 last evening, Sky reported that Silvio Berlusconi had described Kaka as non-transferable.

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11679_4789742,00.html

Yet by 22.07 they had "opened talks".

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11095_4790200,00.html

I'd take £100million for a man out of form. :)

[Win2Win]

I thought I was dreaming when I first heard that. That's enough to keep every football team in the country in business!!

[John]

The Sun reports he'd be on a more reasonable £280k a week

I would like to hope 'more reasonable' is a term you're using very loosely, Mat! :wink

[A_P_McCoy]

Where is this gonna end?

soon top players will be on £1million+ a week

sickkkkk

[mathare]

I would like to hope 'more reasonable' is a term you're using very loosely, Mat! :winkWhy? Do you think £280k a week is less reasonable than half a million a week?

Of course that could just be the difference between nett and gross of course

[John]

No, no - I meant that the difference between 280k and 500k a week is bugger all, in reality.

[mathare]

No, no - I meant that the difference between 280k and 500k a week is bugger all, in reality.I'd happily take the difference home in my pay packet each week.

I know what you mean though. Even if Kaka is only (!) on 280k a week that's around £6 per Man City in the CoM stadium each time he plays there. And of course he doesn't play at home every week. I doubt even the extra merchandising, sponsorship, corporate deals etc will offset that much of his wages so it's a massive loss leader. But does the owner care, what with his massive fortune and all.

The way I see football going in the future though is more things like this happening. The top few players on bigger and bigger deals which will eventually lead to the end of football as we know it. There are only so many idiots to go round and at the minute they seem to be buying English clubs so a lot of the best players are coming over here. This weakens the English national side and also foreign leagues so either FIFA will step in or fans around the world will complain. Would football fans in this country want to see Kaka et al openly picking up a few hundred grand a week while they struggle to earn a fraction of that? Would fans stand there while the national side goes down the toilet? And of course foreign fans will see their leagues drained of the best talent and push for measures to be put in place.

And of course till all that happens agents will push for new contracts for their middling players until we have the Robbie Savages of this world on £80k a week and apprentices on £25k a week in the Premiership. But the lower leagues won't and can't sustain such wage levels so there will be more clubs going into administration as the money from the Premiership no longer flows down the league pyramid. So more clubs like AFC Wimbledon and FCUoM startup and the real football fans go back to the grass roots game as there is no national side of any note to support and they aren't paying the prices necessary to watch the big boys play.

Unless something is done soon this is the end of football.

[counterfeit]

It does make me wonder how much it will cost to prise Ronaldo away from Man U this summer though. If Kaka is worth that much then Ronaldo must be worth £200m and at leat 500k per week.

UTTER, UTTER MADNESS

[Win2Win]

You don't even get £100M for winning the Champions League or Premiership!

[counterfeit]

But the lower leagues won't and can't sustain such wage levels so there will be more clubs going into administration as the money from the Premiership no longer flows down the league pyramid. So more clubs like AFC Wimbledon and FCUoM startup and the real football fans go back to the grass roots game as there is no national side of any note to support and they aren't paying the prices necessary to watch the big boys play.

Unless something is done soon this is the end of football.

Thing is though Mat, there are no "lower leagues" as such in some other countries. Italy and Spain only have 2 professional divisions and they are the reigning World and European Champions.

So, will it really hurt our football or is there an argument to say the opposite?

40 years ago Bradford Park Avenue were a decent standard league club. They died and although there was, no doubt, much gnashing and wailing the upside was that the fan base for Bradford City increased.

Surely, if clubs like Tranmere disappeared then the fans would eventually disperse to Liverpool and Everton, making both of them stronger.

Would we not be better having 40 clubs, 20 of which got crowds of 80,000 a week than 120 (including conference) clubs with appalling attendances.

I don't necessarily agree (especially as an Ipswich fan who wouldn't benefit from any club going bust, except maybe Colchester) but there is more than one side to this argument.

[vegyjones]

If Tranmere disappeared, the next generation may ascend to Liverpool or Everton, but I beg to differ that supporters of Tranmere would disperse to either.

[counterfeit]

Well the really good news would be if Orient went. West Ham and Charlton would get an increase in idiots - just what West Ham need!!!

[mathare]

Thing is though Mat, there are no "lower leagues" as such in some other countries. Italy and Spain only have 2 professional divisions and they are the reigning World and European Champions.

So, will it really hurt our football or is there an argument to say the opposite?There is always an argument to say the opposite but in this case I don't really buy it. The money is flooding in to English football at present and I think it will continue to do so, rather than say French/Spanish/Italian football. We have far more leagues/divisions than most countries which means our football fanbase is more spread out but also dedicated. Few English fans change allegiance from one club to another. They would rather stay loyal to their club even if it goes bust and comes back as a part-time outfit than support local rivals.


40 years ago Bradford Park Avenue were a decent standard league club. They died and although there was, no doubt, much gnashing and wailing the upside was that the fan base for Bradford City increased.True, but I think times have changed. Look at FCUoM, AFC Wimbledon etc. Fans are more willing to start a new club now, even in the feeder leagues, than switch to a rival team.


Surely, if clubs like Tranmere disappeared then the fans would eventually disperse to Liverpool and Everton, making both of them stronger. I don't agree with that, I'm afraid. I think a small percentage of the Tranmere fans would switch to Everton or Liverpool but many will stay with whatever Tranmere becomes, and it would be reborn in some guise or other.


Would we not be better having 40 clubs, 20 of which got crowds of 80,000 a week than 120 (including conference) clubs with appalling attendances.Perhaps, but I don't see a world where that would happen.


I don't necessarily agree (especially as an Ipswich fan who wouldn't benefit from any club going bust, except maybe Colchester) but there is more than one side to this argument.I love the fact that you've posted a side of the argument you don't necessarily agree with it - great balance :)

The other thing I think will happen is that mid-table clubs will sign second tier stars, or perhaps one outstanding player. But they won't have the finances in place to be able to support the contract offered to this player so they raise ticket prices etc and alienate fans who stop going which reduced revenue which means the big clubs are in more financial difficulties. Fans want to see the best players but will they pay £50+ a ticket to see them play? If fan wages aren't also rising in line with player wages they will no longer be able to afford to go to matches so will choose a cheaper club.

[counterfeit]

Mat - I grew up in Newport as a Newport County fan. When they died, they did reform after a while and the fans largely stayed loyal but that was a geographical thing (we hate Cardiff and Bristol).

You have contadicted your own argument by the way. You say fans won't go to another club if their club dies but will go to another club if their favoured club gets too expensive.

So, do fans have a loyalty or not?

[mathare]

So, do fans have a loyalty or not?Yes, to a point.

What I meant was fans of smaller clubs are more likely to stick with them as the club would reform somehow, whereas fans of Premiership teams are more likely to desert their club on financial grounds. Either way I don't it looking good for clubs going forward unless FIFA step in before the amount of money sloshing about gets out of hand.

League Two has wage caps (60% of turnover) so why not extend that across the rest of football?

[Win2Win]

Well the really good news would be if Orient went. West Ham and Charlton would get an increase in idiots - just what West Ham need!!!
Two each :thumbs

[scoobydoo]

Well the really good news would be if Orient went. West Ham and Charlton would get an increase in idiots - just what West Ham need!!!


Two each :thumbs

:laugh

I can feel a vegy reply in the wind. :D

[vegyjones]

Well the really good news would be if Orient went. West Ham and Charlton would get an increase in idiots - just what West Ham need!!!
:mad: Right... a welshman residing in Ipswich... there's too many jokes, so I won't go there. And at least at my team I'm not related to everyone else in the ground!

Two each :thumbs
;fire As for you, I see Man United are winning. Be top by Saturday afternoon! And bloody good job!

[scoobydoo]

:mad: Right... a welshman residing in Ipswich... there's too many jokes, so I won't go there. And at least at my team I'm not related to everyone else in the ground!

;fire As for you, I see Man United are winning. Be top by Saturday afternoon! And bloody good job!

Well played that man! :thumbs

[MattR]

The way I see football going in the future though is more things like this happening. The top few players on bigger and bigger deals which will eventually lead to the end of football as we know it. There are only so many idiots to go round and at the minute they seem to be buying English clubs so a lot of the best players are coming over here. This weakens the English national side .

That's still an arguement I don't buy about the weakening of the national side. If the players are good enough then they'll come through to the first teams. As long as they are being coached properly then they'll come through.


Would football fans in this country want to see Kaka et al openly picking up a few hundred grand a week while they struggle to earn a fraction of that? Would fans stand there while the national side goes down the toilet?

Unfortunately we already do Mat. In fact, although the wages spoken about Kaka are ridiculous. It's actually not so much the top players that I have a problem with but the lesser players as you mentioned. Yes the top players wages are ludicrous in relation to the real world man's wage, but it's the 20,30 grand a week players who have a fraction of Ronaldo's (etc) talent that are even more grossly overpaid. And as you say that's a result of the clubs paying silly money to the 'stars' All the time one club will pay more and more then all the rest have to follow. The 40 million sky contract just about covers most of the lesser Premier teams wage bills now and that's just to try and stay in the Premier. It is crazy and will go bang before long.


So more clubs like AFC Wimbledon and FCUoM startup and the real football fans go back to the grass roots game as there is no national side of any note to support and they aren't paying the prices necessary to watch the big boys play..


Unfortunately that's where football has a captive audience unlike any other non sport entertainment. They have milked the fans knowing they'll still come, at least until recently and now the clubs are starting to realise that they are pricing people out of coming to watch the game. I go to very few away games these days because it is just such an expensive day out now. £40ish for a ticket before you even add in travel/food/drink etc. It's great being in the Premier and seeing the better quality football but some of the best days at football were in the lower leagues and always will be.

[quote=mathare;489282]Few English fans change allegiance from one club to another. They would rather stay loyal to their club even if it goes bust and comes back as a part-time outfit than support local rivals.

[quote]

Totally right Mat. If Portsmouth went to the wall there is no way I would go to watch Southampton. I would watch non league.