Hague: UK recognises Libya rebels

[Win2Win Racing]

The UK is to expel all Libyan diplomats and invite the rebel National Transitional Council to take their place as the "sole governmental authority".

More... (http://www.bbc.co.uk/go/rss/int/news/-/news/uk-politics-14306544)

[Godspot]

H'mmm...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rNWf1kw2eUk

[scoobydoo]

I may not believe my government totally, or the French government or the US government but who the :censored: is this bloke...why should I believe him? It just looks like a propaganda film to me.

[Godspot]

but who the :censored: is this bloke...why should I believe him? It just looks like a propaganda film to me.

Thomas C. Mountain is an independent western journalist based in the Horn of Africa, and has been living and reporting from Eritrea since 2006. He was a member of the 1st US Peace Delegation to Libya in 1987.

Oh, & I see my mate Richard Falk (special rapporteur to the UN) likes the site & if u like I can get corroborating links for just about everything he says from other sources - if I had the time but

Libya War Lies Worse Than Iraq
by Thomas C. Mountain
July 23, 2011

The lies used to justify the NATO war against Libya have surpassed those created to justify the invasion of Iraq. Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch both had honest observers on the ground for months following the rebellion in eastern Libya and both have repudiated every major charge used to justify the NATO war on Libya.

According to the Amnesty observer, who is fluent in Arabic, there is not one confirmed instance of rape by the pro-Gadaffi fighters, not even a doctor who knew of one. All the Viagra mass rape stories were fabrications.

Amnesty could not verify a single “African mercenary” fighting for Gaddafi story, and the highly charged international satellite television accounts of African mercenaries raping women that were used to panic much of the eastern Libyan population into fleeing their homes were fabrications.

There were no confirmed accounts of helicopter gunships attacking civilians and no jet fighters bombing people, which completely invalidates any justification for the No-Fly Zone in the Security Council resolution used as an excuse for NATO to launch its attacks on Libya.

After three months on the ground in rebel controlled territory, the Amnesty investigator could only confirm 110 deaths in Benghazi, which included Gadaffi supporters.

Only 110 dead in Benghazi? Wait a minute, we were told thousands had died there, ten thousand even. No, only 110 lost their lives, including pro-government people.

No rapes, no African mercenaries, no helicopter gunships or bombers, and only 110 ten deaths prior to the launch of the NATO bombing campaign; every reason was based on a lie.

Today, according to the Libyan Red Crescent Society, over 1,100 civilians have been killed by NATO bombs, including over 400 women and children. Over 6,000 Libyan civilians have been injured or wounded by the bombing, many very seriously.

Compared to the war on Iraq, these numbers are tiny, but the reasons for the Libyan war have no merit in any form.

Saddam Hussein was evil; he invaded his neighbors in wars that killed up to a million. He used Weapons of Mass Destruction (WMD) in the form of poison gas on both his neighbors and his own people, killing tens of thousands. He was brutal and corrupt and when American tanks rolled into Iraq the Iraqi people refused to fight for him, simply put their weapons down and went home.

Libya under Col. Gadaffi hasn’t invaded their neighbors. Gadaffi never used WMD on anyone, let alone his own people. As for Gadaffi being brutal, in Libya’s neighbor Algeria, the Algerian military fought a counterinsurgency for a decade in the 1990’s that witnessed the deaths of some 200,000 Algerians. Now that is brutal and nothing anywhere near this has happened in Libya.

In Egypt and Tunisia, western puppets like Mubarak and Ben Ali had almost no support amongst their people with few if anyone willing to fight and die to defend them.

The majority of the Libyan people are rallying behind the Libyan government and “the leader”, Muammar Gadaffi, with over one million people demonstrating in support on July 1 in Tripoli, the capital of Libya. Thousands of Libyan youth are on the front lines fighting the rebels and despite thousands of NATO air strikes, authentic journalists on the ground in western Libya report that their morale remains high.

In Egypt, the popular explosion that resulted in the Army seizing power from Mubarak began in the very poorest neighborhoods in Cairo and other Egyptian cities where the price of basic food items like bread, sugar, and cooking oil had skyrocketed and led to widespread hunger. In many parts of Egypt’s poor neighborhoods, gasoline/benzene is easier to find then clean drinking water. Medical care and education is only for those with the money to pay for it. Life for the people of Tunisia is not that much better.

In contrast, the Libyan people have the longest life expectancy in the Arab world. The Libyan people have the best, free public health system in the Arab world. The Libyan people have the best, free public education system in the Arab world. Most Libyan families own their own home and most Libyan families own their own automobile. Libya is so much better off than its neighbors every year tens of thousands of Egyptians and Tunisians migrated to Libya to earn money to feed their families, doing the dirty work the Libyan people refused to do.

When it comes to how Gadaffi oversaw a dramatic rise in the standard of living for the Libyan people despite decades of UN inSecurity Council sanctions against the Libyan economy, honest observers acknowledge that Gadaffi stands head and shoulders above the kings, sheiks, emirs and various dictators who rule the rest of the Arab world.

So why did NATO launch this war against Libya?

First of all, Gadaffi was on the verge of creating a new banking system in Africa that was going to put the IMF, World Bank, and assorted other western banksters out of business in Africa. No more predatory western loans used to cripple African economies; instead, a $42 billion dollar African Investment Bank would be supplying major loans at little or even zero interest rates.

Libya has funded major infrastructure projects across Africa that have begun to link up African economies and break the perpetual dependency on the western countries for imports. Here in Eritrea, the new road connecting Eritrea and Sudan is just one small example.

What seems to have finally tipped the balance in favor of direct western military intervention was the reported demand by Gadaffi that the USA oil companies who have long been major players in the Libyan petroleum industry were going to have to compensate Libya to the tune of tens of billions of dollars for the damage done to the Libyan economy by the USA instigated “Lockerbie Bombing” sanctions imposed by the UN inSecurity Council throughout the 1990’s into early 2000’s. This is based on the unearthing of evidence that the CIA paid millions of dollars to witnesses in the Lockerbie Bombing trial to change their stories to implicate Libya, which was used as the basis for the very damaging UN sanctions against Libya. The government of the USA lied and damaged Libya so the USA oil companies were going to have to pay up to cover the cost of their government’s actions. Not hard to see why Gadaffi had to go, is it?

Add the fact that Gadaffi had signaled clearly that he saw both Libya’s and Africa’s future economic development linked more to China and Russia, rather than the west, and it was just a matter of time before the CIA’s contingency plan to overthrow the Libyan government was put on the front burner.

NATO’s war against Libya has much more in common with NATO’s Kosovo war against Serbia. But one still cannot compare Gadaffi to Saddam or even the much smaller-time criminals in the Serbian leadership. The Libyan War lies are worse than Iraq.

http://www.foreignpolicyjournal.com/2011/07/23/libya-war-lies-worse-than-iraq/#comments

& nobody in the comments is arguing with him.

[lowe1]

Well i must know the few people in Libya who hate Kadaffi


This man states

" Amnesty could not verify a single “African mercenary” fighting for Gaddafi story, and the highly charged international satellite television accounts of African mercenaries raping women that were used to panic much of the eastern Libyan population into fleeing their homes were fabrications "

My Libyan friends tell me that all the homeless Africans saving up to get to Italy are being paid to join the Army an bolster ranks. also Kadaafi party members are handing out food vouchers for people who are seen to be celebrating when Kadaffi is out making a speach in Tripoli.

There were no confirmed accounts of helicopter gunships attacking civilians and no jet fighters bombing people, which completely invalidates any justification for the No-Fly Zone in the Security Council resolution used as an excuse for NATO to launch its attacks on Libya.

Both Desert oil camps i worked at ( ZELTEN 103A SOUTH AND NORTH ) have been bombed by Kaddafi forces also a lot of these camps had a lot of local people inside still looking after them when they were bombed with no warning this has been confirmed by international company Schlumberger who owned both camps and have lost 2 mill plus

Today, according to the Libyan Red Crescent Society, over 1,100 civilians have been killed by NATO bombs, including over 400 women and children. Over 6,000 Libyan civilians have been injured or wounded by the bombing, many very seriously

Again all the people i know still in Tripoli have said the bombing has not hit or killed civillian people like Kadaffi is reporting


Libya under Col. Gadaffi hasn’t invaded their neighbors. Gadaffi never used WMD on anyone, let alone his own people. As for Gadaffi being brutal, in Libya’s neighbor Algeria, the Algerian military fought a counterinsurgency for a decade in the 1990’s that witnessed the deaths of some 200,000 Algerians. Now that is brutal and nothing anywhere near this has happened in Libya.

He has been Brutal to his own people , do you actually know the reason why fighting started in Benghazi ??? it was because of what Kadaffi done to his own people and how they stopped Fathi Tirbil from trying to find out the truth , i suggest you google him and read the story

In contrast, the Libyan people have the longest life expectancy in the Arab world. The Libyan people have the best, free public health system in the Arab world. The Libyan people have the best, free public education system in the Arab world. Most Libyan families own their own home and most Libyan families own their own automobile. Libya is so much better off than its neighbors every year tens of thousands of Egyptians and Tunisians migrated to Libya to earn money to feed their families, doing the dirty work the Libyan people refused to do

It is obvious you have not lived there like me and seen the country first hand

A lot of people i worked with in Libya have move to Tunisia or Egypt to get away from Kadaffi as his men are bullying people and people are disappearing all the time , 2 of my friends we told to join the Army or die , these people are on my facebook with one of them nobody has had contact since April i regularly check his facebook and leave a message as do other people

I have people from Libya on my facebook who i worked with in Libya so if you don't believe what i am saying i can easily put you in touch with them

[lowe1]

Fathi Terbil was fighting for the families of the people who died here

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2009/09/06/uk-libya-massacre-idUKTRE5850PJ20090906

If you google Libya Human rights you will find a lot more than just this one

[lowe1]

Some more info for you

http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/hrrpt/2009/nea/136074.htm

http://www.hrw.org/reports/2008/09/02/libya-rights-risk

[Godspot]

if you don't believe what i am saying i can easily put you in touch with them

Don't matter if I do or don't - you've not made a case to constitute the bombing of a sovereign state. We'd be at war with more than 1/2 the world if we were to go against all leaders that mistreated their own people. Why aren't we going for Syria or Bahrain? Total hypocrisy....

[lowe1]

Ok but i have shown you that some of the points you raised by Thomas C. Mountain are wrong :thumbs:thumbs so don't believe everything you read

[Godspot]

Ok but i have shown you that some of the points you raised by Thomas C. Mountain are wrong :thumbs:thumbs so don't believe everything you read

I don't & it says as much up there but this is the legal basis of our involvement in Libya according to Richard Falk http://wp.me/p19Wt7-8M

" In a world beset by contradictions, there are only hard choices. There seem to be three kinds of situation that somewhat transcend this tension between liberal and critical perspectives: a severe natural disaster that cannot be addressed by national capabilities ( Asian tsunami of 2004; Haiti earthquake of 2010) acute or imminent genocide as in Rwanda (1994) where a small international effort would have seemed likely to avert the deaths of hundreds of thousands; a mandate to act issued by the UN Security Council as in Libya. In each instance, there are risks, uncertainties, and unanticipated effects; especially worrisome is the recent pattern of authorizations of force by the Security Council. Both in the Gulf War (1991), to some extent the sanctions currently imposed on Iran, and now with the Libyan intervention, the mandate to use force is stretched beyond the limits specified in the language of authorization. In the Libyan case, Security Council Resolution 1973 the initial justification for intervention was justified by reference to an emergency situation endangering the lives of many Libyan civilians, but converted operationally and massively by NATO into a mandate to achieve regime change in Tripoli by dislodging the Qaddafi leadership. No effort was made to secure a broader mandate from the Security Council and nothing was done to insist that NATO operations be limited by the terms of the original UN authorization.

What can be done? We have little choice but to cope as best we can with these contradictions, especially when it comes to uses of force in the course of what is labeled as a ‘humanitarian intervention’ or an application of the ‘right to protect’ norm."

[lowe1]

After posting on this thread i wsent onto facebook and sent a message to a friend in Libya to ask how he and his family is and this is the reply i got

hi tony and thank you for asking . yes me and my family are ok but it looks like it is going to get ugly ..just last night al gadafi's fighters have taken three families were traveling from jalow city to ajdabya city where i live. they found an impty cars on the black top with some women and kids clothes.
any way how are you man and do you have david address the guy who was working with you?

It makes you realise doesn't it how lucky we are sometimes

Black top is the black you see on sand mounds in the desert by the way

[Godspot]

I think it's going to get ugly too -

WikiLeaks documents shed light on US-backed intervention in Libya
By Robert Morgan

July 27, 2011 - US diplomatic cables released by WikiLeaks expose some of the real reasons and diplomatic tensions behind NATO’s ongoing bombardment of Libya. Far from initiating a "humanitarian" intervention to protect civilians against Muammar Gaddafi’s government, Washington backed the NATO intervention for one reason only—the installation of a regime that better serves the strategic interests of the US, as well as the operations of the giant oil and gas companies. The cables date back to 2007, some three years after the Bush administration had lifted sanctions and formally re-established relations with the Gaddafi regime in a bid to secure access to Libya’s highly prized resources. Until the outbreak of revolutionary uprisings across the Middle East this year, Gaddafi was welcomed with open arms in Washington and internationally.
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2011/jul2011/wiki-j27.shtml

[Godspot]

This is pretty well sourced from a man on the spot too:

The War on Libya : An Imperialist Project to Create Three Libyas

by Mahdi Darius Nazemroaya
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=25637
Global Research, July 29, 2011

The division of Libya into three separate countries is part of the US-NATO imperial design. It is part of a project shared by the U.S., Britain, Italy, and France.

The NATO war launched against Libya in March 2011 was geared towards the breakup of the country into three separate entitities.

The NATO led war, however, is back firing. The Libyan people have united to save their country and Tripoli is exploring its strategic options.

Preface: Reality versus Fiction

Almost all of the text herein was written a few months prior to my trip to Tripoli. It is part of a series of articles on Libya which I have been updating. It is fitting to conclude it in Tripoli, Libya. To be here on the ground in Libya is to be witness to the lies and warped narratives of the mainstream media and the governments. These lies have been used to justify this criminal military endeavor.

The mainstream media has been a major force in this war. They have endorsed and fabricated the news, they have justified an illegal and criminal war against an entire population.

Passing through the neighbourhood of Fashloom in Tripoli it is apparent that no jets attacked it as Al Jazeera and the British Broadcasting Corporation (BBC) falsely claimed. Now the same media networks, newspapers, and wires claim on a daily basis that Tripoli is about to fall and that the Transitional Council is making new advances to various cities. Tripoli is nowhere near falling and is relatively peaceful. Foreign journalists have also all been taken to the areas that are being reported to have fallen to the Transitional Council, such as Sabha and its environs.

The mainstream media reporting out of Tripoli have consistently produced false reports.

[Godspot]

It just looks like a propaganda film to me.

I suppose it's all propaganda really but there does seem to have been a major swing in opinions regards Libya recently according to my inbox - [& sorry if it seems like I keep banging on but I like to keep useful links in one place] - from

Libya: a deafening silence

By Jody McIntyre
Notebook
Tuesday, 7 June 2011 at 9:56 am

So now we are sending Apache jets to bomb Libyan civilians. - - Unlike Afghanistan and Iraq, which provoked huge outcries across the world, the reaction to Libya has been relatively muted. We have been sold on a false premise, and, as Noam Chomsky would say, have allowed the manufacture of our consent.

Now that the initial smokescreen has been proven a success, - - http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2011/06/07/libya-a-deafening-silence/

to more recent:

Thursday, 28 July 2011

If only a brave bunch of anti war activists could occupy the Libyan Embassy in London before the Benghazi 'rebel' diplomats enter the building.


David Cameron's war on the Libyan people moves up a gear with William Hague’s decision to pore money into the coffers of the ragbag of long time exiles, islamists and opportunists on the make, who are based in Benghazi and who have failed their western masters so dismally in the field.

Almost every assumption Hague has made about the Gaddafi regime has turned out to be wrong. He and his fellow NATO foreign Ministers, first presumed with a little saber rattling Gaddafi would cut and run. When this failed they set up their very own ‘murder incorporated’ and attempted to knock the old rouge off the twig. Far from laying a hand on Gaddafi they managed to murder one of his son’s and three grandchildren.

Old Muammar having cut his teeth in the snake pit of Arab high politics, both at home and aboard and not being slow himself when it comes to low cunning must have quaked with fear when the International court indicted him with war crimes, especially when not a hand has been laid on those who perpetrated the death of over 500,000 Iraqi's. Gaddafi, a man who has spent most of his career tweaking the tails of such poodle institutions and their political masters was hardly going to lose much sleep over this piece of political chicanery.
Now, despite international law, the UK has recognized the Benghazi ‘rebels’ as the legitimate government of Libya, even though they hold less than a third of the countries territory, and asked all diplomats belonging to Muammar Gaddafi's government to leave the United Kingdom. At the same time as he announced this, Hague said.

"Britain was unfreezing ninety one million pounds of Libyan oil assets to help the National Transitional Council, which the country now recognizes as "the sole governmental authority in Libya."
Shorty after Hague's announcement Mustafa Abdul Jalil speaking from Benghazi said
"This means Gaddafi and his followers are no longer legitimate.''

There you have it, as far as this satrap in the making is concerned, when his British master’s proclaim it, it becomes fact, to hell with precedent, international law and common decency, as long as the monarchs man across the water has decreed it, that is that. The British Empire is alive and well and living in the Benghazi strip.
A thought struck me when wading through this muck, if only we lived in a world in which a brave bunch of anti war activists could occupy the Libyan Embassy in London before the Benghazi 'rebel' diplomats enter the building. I can think of no better people for the departing Libyan diplomats to leave the keys of the build with for safe keeping.

Now that would be a sight worth seeing.
http://www.organizedrage.com/2011/07/if-only-brave-bunch-of-anti-war.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+OrganizedRage+%28ORGANIZED+RAGE%29&utm_content=Yahoo%21+Mail

But back to propaganda:

The Imperialist Partition of Libya
Protesilaos Stavrou

July 28, 2011 - ...The decision to recognize the rebel group as the official government cannot be justified upon real grounds, but only upon propaganda. How can NATO member-states that have waged war in the name of "democracy" and with the excuse of "protecting" civilians, recognize as the official representative of the Libyan people, a group that was not democratically elected? The rebels are not legitimized to represent the Libyan people anyhow as no elections have ever taken place. Also, more than half of the population is still supporting Gaddafi and is willing to continue fighting in his name. So which "Libyan people" is the National Transitional Counsil "legitimately representing"?... Judging all available information and the decisions that have been taken so far it becomes clear that the intension of the West is to partition Libya. To make the rebel-controlled part a NATO protectorate in North Africa and to leave Gaddafi control the rest, for as long as he can....

Read the full article / Leggi l'articolo completo: http://www.uruknet.de/?p=80017

[Godspot]

Shame they can't recognise, children, civilians & refugee camps:
http://www.uruknet.de/?l=x&p=-6&size=1&hd=0

Video: Bloody NATO Massacre Kills 85 Civilians Incl. Children (August 8-9, 2011) near Zlitan/Majer, Libya
Libya State TV



continua / continued [80335] [ 09-aug-2011 17:30 ECT ]
Libyan TV says children killed in NATO strike
Reuters

August 9, 2011 – Libyan state media said on Tuesday dozens of civilians had been killed in a NATO strike on a village about 150 km (90 miles) east of Tripoli, and the alliance said it was looking into the reports. Libyan state television showed the charred bodies of at least three young children who, it said, were killed by a NATO strike on Monday night on the village of Majar. It also showed wounded women and children being treated in a hospital.,,

continua / continued [80334] [ 09-aug-2011 14:53 ECT ]
UN official "deplores" NATO attack on Libyan TV
Reuters

August 8, 2011 - The head of the U.N. cultural agency UNESCO sharply rebuked NATO on Monday for its July 30 air strikes against Libyan state television that killed several people and wounded nearly a dozen. "I deplore the NATO strike on Al-Jamahiriya and its installations," UNESCO Director-General Irina Bokova said in a statement. "Media outlets should not be targeted in military actions," she said. "U.N. Security Council Resolution 1738 (2006) condemns acts of violence against journalists and media personnel in conflict situations."...
continua / continued [80338] [ 09-aug-2011 18:29 ECT ]
Dispatch From Tripoli
Where Have Libya's Children Gone?
By FRANKLIN LAMB

August 8, 2011 - The quality of life continues to degrade in certain areas of western Libya while public anxiety noticeably rises over missing Libyan children as the first week of an unusually stressful Ramadan passes. The shortage of gasoline has become acute and despite government efforts to curtail price gouging, one taxi driver told this observer yesterday that while the usual price of 'benzene' was five liters (one gallon) for $.40 (forty US cents) he is now having to pay as much as " 4 dinars for one liter of petrol!" That is roughly the equivalent of 13 US dollars for a gallon of gasoline, a huge price surge in a country long accustomed to cheap, heavily subsidized fuel. "Informal economy" (black market) fuel arrives in car trunks from the Tunisian border and its increasingly common to see fellows with a make shift funnel trying to get more benzene into their vehicle tanks than they splash and spill on neighborhood streets...
continua / continued [80337] [ 09-aug-2011 18:23 ECT ]

[Godspot]

Better link to the above:

NATO Kills 85 Civilians In Libya

Video

Video shows outrage to the massacre of 85 civilians by NATO
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article28809.htm